Newsom's Uncomfortable Interview With Hank Plante
NBC Picks Up Troubled Trauma?
Muni Removing Bus Stops on 21 Hayes Line
Chilling Account of a Muni Mugging
Closeup of Anti-Whoring Sign at Powell and Market
Scott James of NYT Bay Area did something a bit crafty. He perched a camera at Duboce and Steiner, capturing cars and cyclists during their morning commutes. While not the busiest or most dangerous intersection in San Francisco, it is, as James points out, a complex one where "cars, pedestrians, cyclists and the MUNI N-Line all converge."
During the speedy video (40 minutes condensed to 8), "7 cyclists come to a complete stop, 15 cyclists pause at a stop sign before continuing and 91 cyclists blow through the intersection." Goodness, that sounds rather dangerous.
It should also be noted that several vehicles performed "California rolls," which is when drivers don't come to a complete stop. Which, of course, is perfectly fine. (This is California. Let's not get crazy, folks.)
In happier cycling news, Sunny Angulo made this VidSF film about last week's Halloween's Critical Mass ride. Enjoy.
(Video: TimesSF)
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yawn.
so much so that you watched it, then made yet another this-is-lame-dude comment about it. well played, sir.
Dear Mr. sf_bikebike,
Something tells you're the kind of guy who starts sentences with, "Listen man, I know I'm an asshole but.."
Thanks for pitching in, I hate to think where we'd be now without your can-do team spirit.
Have a safe and happy friday,
Brandon
thank you.
I like the part (@ 0:59) where the dude who is illegally parked remembers that his coffee cup from Duboce Park Cafe is on top of the car.
Also, it should be noted that no cars are crossing the intersection from Steiner to head down Sanchez because that has been closed to traffic every Monday-Friday from 7am -4:30pm due to the seemingly unending construction project replacing the sewer mains. So, the cyclists are also riding through a construction zone with a big orange ROAD CLOSED sign at the end to of Sanchez.
Oh, well. The rules don't apply to them.
let the whining begin
I thought the term was 'California Roll.' I've been doing my best to import that to NYC.
you're right!
weird, I'm in the vid... I'm trying to slow it down to see if I paused at that stop sign
this intersection is part of my commute, though i think i head to work a bit earlier than the footage started.
irregardlessley, i think this video highlights how well pedestrians, bicyclists, vehicle drivers, and muni trains are able to share the space without following the letter of the law.
yeah, I never notice that as a troublesome intersection.
The messier intersection in that neighborhood is Haight & Steiner (where "The Wiggle" meets Haight by Burger Joint/Axum). Bikes go fast and turn at that intersection so any of them that don't stop usually create a pretty interesting standoff with the pedestrians and vehicles trying to cross.
erratum: I meant Haight and Pierce.
Dammit. I logged in just to correct you. Now I'll actually have to post something productive to justify the effort.
I come to a complete stop on my bike here all the time. All the time that there's an N in the way.
Other shocking discoveries from this video: grass is green; most people have two legs and two arms.
They really picked the wrong intersection to do this in. A proper four-way stop intersection in the Wiggle (say Page and Scott) or on Haight as someone mentioned would be more interesting. That intersection is already so weird (with Sanchez being offset, the tracks, and the construction, etc) and with most of the bikes taking only one path (steiner duboce) that it's just not interesting -- since it's so difficult to navigate, I think most people are pretty careful, even if not strictly law-abiding. At Page and Scott there is a bigger range of directions people go from the intersection.
It's much better if you imagine the "Benny Hill" theme music in the background.
Benny Hillified, for your viewing pleasure:
http://james.nerdiphythesoul.com/bennyhillifier/?id=BV_oiLRNR2I
I was hoping for the old timey silent movie piano music.
Try this:
http://ln-s.net/4XS6
Hmm... I think it'd be interesting if someone did this at Church and Market, just to see how many cars speed through their lights and how many cyclists almost get hit.
Every time a car hits a cyclist, an angel gets its wings :D
I wanna see one at Church and 17th, where the 3 Muni lines converge. Fast motion crashes of cyclists bailing in the tracks would be heee-larious!
I've seen that, looks painful, but funny.
Do you mean at Church and 14th? I can't picture 3 lines converging at Church and 17th.
3 way T-intersection. There's some kind of F-line turnaround on 17th. I agree, though. 14th is far more of a steely mess.
So not only are they blowing stop signs but most of them also don't have brakes. Two violations of CA state law, where the fuck are the cops on this one?
The argument I've always heard is that the gear set of a fixed gear cycle itself qualifies as a break under CA law. Really not sure if that's true, but I suspect some police officers don't like 'fixee kids' either, and if it wasn't true they'd be ticketing.
I also will say that as a cyclist, one with breaks, whenever these sorts of debates come up the fact remains that a when cyclists and drivers collide, it's cyclists who die, not the drivers.
People have argued that - it's never worked, AFAIK.
"No person shall operate a bicycle on a roadway unless it
is equipped with a brake which will enable the operator to make one braked wheel skid on dry, level, clean pavement"
Busy enforcing laws that matter.
Ha, kidding. But at least enforcing laws that matter more than those two.
Ever heard of a coaster brake?
Whoops, wrong thread replied to. Sorry!
...Or not. God, this comment reply system sucks.
Yeah, I was overall pretty impressed by how well it all worked out given how hectic it is. Totally agree, Page and Scott, next to where I live, is much scarier, and I say that as a usually-pedestrian, sometimes cyclist, and every-once-in-a-while motorist.
Pet peeve rampage:
I've lived in California my entire life and have NEVER heard a "California stop" or "rolling stop" called a "California roll."
Is the person who suggested this one of the people responsible for trying to rename the Tenderloin as North of Market?
/end grump
See, I've heard this term from Placerville to San Diego since I was a wee child. As a native, I'm surprised you haven't heard it. Also, I just can't imagine driving any other way!
Same here. I have fond memories as a child of pulling up to a stop sign with my dad driving as he proclaims "california stop!" and just rolls on through the intersection.
Brock's right, it's called a 'California Stop'......
I was born in Los Angeles as a wee little one and only lived out of Cali for a couple of years at a time over the years.
It's always even by the big 5-0 called a 'California Stop'.
If you don't believe me ask the Judge the next time what your paying for is called.
"What is called a 'California Stop' , technically you didn't stop at the red."
Even if you look at the ticket the cop wrote it would say "California Stop".... the reason you were cited.
OH by the way I know having gotten busted in Alameda on a motorcycle for doing one.
Let's not act like driving was invented in California. Guess what we called it back in New York?
Yes, that's right. We called it the Florida Stop.
That's right we invented everything.
And It's called a 'California Stop'!
let's assume that a car that does NOT come to a complete stop does in fact brake and slows down to, say, 5 MPH, and they proceed through the stop sign at that speed. If they were going 20-25 and slow to 5, it seems like a pretty great reduction, and to most drivers it is. That car driver is now at 20% of the starting speed. Hey, that's awesome! Congratulations, driver!
Now if I'm on my bike and going 10MPH but then slow to 5, I am now going 50% of my orig speed. I roll through the stop sign at that speed and I'm now part of a hit piece the NYT originated and SFist picks up and runs with. Yay! ... wait, I mean Boo! Bikes are bad!
We should adopt the Stop-and-Roll model that Idaho has -- then we can start calling it the Idaho Stop, at least for bikes.
I've lived my entire life in the Boston area and have always heard of it called "California Roll"
I don't have time right now, but later I hope to come up with a car count.
By my quick count, there were 309 cars going through the intersection. And if the writer counted 113 cyclists, it looks like 37% of the traffic was going to work by bike that morning. Dang, that's about the same percentage as Copenhagen! But SF has only minimal infrastructure for biking.
Oops, miscalculated. Actually the 113 cyclists from the total of 422 vehicles would be 27%.
My friend was cited for running the stop sign at this intersection about a month ago. A motorcycle cop pulled her over and said that a lot of local residents have been complaining about it. Fair enough, but at least two of the stop signs are obscured by trees and posts (although STOP is painted on the street). Lessons learned.
Thought it was "Hollywood Stop".
Big smile, big wave, but roll on through..
Is there a term for the hesitant "herky-jerky starts and stops" we see at intersections in the Sunset District?
you mean the asian nose-poke? i call it the "don't even try it, asshole" when i'm riding through there.
This was not the wankstorm I was looking for.
LOL. I know!
Wait, that ended up a reply to the wrong post. sorry...
Several vehicles performed "California rolls"? Looked like just about everyone who wasn't waiting for cross traffic to me.
that's pretty much it. in the first 1:22, I count 40 rolls vs 4 stops.
I only come to a full stop when I drive drunk.
Yea, I can see that happening around 'Golden Gate' park on any day of the week.
Though I have to post this as it's my fav' Bike ride so far....
I was there.....
oh and Brock, Leanne, or Jay.... please don't blackball this link. I didn't make it and I'm not even in it though it lets people know what 'Critical Mass' Halloween in San Francisco is like from the get go....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tig1T97At3I&feature=related
Oh and I was in the bike ride that night on my Schwinn.... Shout out to Wonder Woman and Sexy Cop Girl...
Supergirl over.....
P.S. Sexy Cop Girl.... yea I want to play, you caught me off guard.
I had to stop watching after 4 minutes because of all the bikes turning left in front of cars turning right. My stomach is queasy still. I'd like to see a count of how many bikes used hand signals -- and I guess we could count the cars indicating as well.
Brilliant use of camera angle and position to show only 1 of the 4 stop signs in this intersection. That way, we can all make up stories that fit our prejudices, without the bother of actual video evidence.
The NYT implies is that this is a typical, square 4-way intersection. It's not. It has weird angles, and when you're actually in the intersection, it feels more like two separate intersections awkwardly grafted together.
Look at that intersection in Google StreetView. The eastbound stop on Duboce is way back at the end of the cafe wall. Westbound on Duboce, the sign is fully two buildings back from the view we have in the intersection.
I ride my bike from the Mission to SOMA every day & consistently get honked/yelled at for stopping at stop signs & waiting for red lights. (note: I have a car in the city too, so I feel like I have a pretty good perspective on the whole bike/car co-exist thing.)
Just now, in fact, on my way home a crazy lady yelled, "damn bikes!" after I stopped at a stop sign...
80% of the time, I'll walk or take MUNI to where I need to go in the city.
15% of the time, I'll ride my bike.
5% of the the time, I'll ride my motorcycle, when it's just not feasible to get there any other way.
And ya know what? I fucking *despise* how a large portion of asshats-on-bikes behave in SF.
As a cyclist and a motorcyclist I'm completely aware of how both groups are given little to no consideration by drivers who are off in their own little boxed-in worlds. I can't count the number of times I've had to do something drastic to avoid some dingbat who wasn't paying attention.
That said -- the bulk of my close-calls in the city haven't been because of "cagers" in cars. They've ALL been due to total idiots on bikes blowing through red lights.
You may think it's cool to assert, illegally, your righteousness as a hipster on a bicycle... but you're eventually going to get flattened. Don't expect any sympathy from those of us who are dicks with our mode of transport.
"Don't expect any sympathy from those of us who are dicks with our mode of transport."
that says it all.
Try the Page/Franklin/Market intersection, where every morning people on bikes blow through the light, cross several lanes of rush hour traffic, and often ride on the crowded sidewalk or against the flow. It never ceases to amaze me that they put themselves and drivers in such danger, and for what? To get to work one minute earlier? If the city wants to make a buck, ticket those idiots who are making ALL cyclists look bad.
call me crazy but i didn't see a single cyclist stop and put their foot down. that is a legal stop. surprising more, nobody got hurt in this video. crazy stuff.
There's nothing in the California Vehicle Code that says a cyclist must put their foot down to be considered as having come to a full stop. And, in fact, it's quite easy to come to a full stop on a bike without ever taking a foot off a pedal.
I've been a pedestrian in the city for over 3 years and I nearly get run over by more bicyclists than I do cars or buses.
No tears shed when I hear one of 'em gets hit by a car. Never.
It doesn't hurt anyone if a cyclist blows through a Stop unless they are interfering with someone else's right of way. Most cyclists blow through Stops but most cyclists also check for competing traffic before doing so.
That's not following the letter of the law, but who actually follows the letter of the law all the time? No entire group, for sure and, almost universally, no single individual.
Let's be merciless about ticketing cyclists who blow through intersections when they don't have right of way and quit whining about cyclists who go through the Stop sign of an empty intersection.