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Have you heard that BART and Muni fares are increasing? A news story that seems to pop up at least once a month? Or not? Anyway, BART prices will increase on July 1. And Muni will jump to $2 on July 1 as well. We're sure it's way more complicated than we could possibly imagine, rife with locals politicking, Excel spreadsheets, and lots of chin scratching. But feel free to lose your proverbial shit over the increase in the comments, even though both fares are still pretty damn cheap compared to other big cities. (Or not.)
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Looks like the bailouts worked.
Chicago Transit Authority fare from downtown Chicago to airport: $2.25. Screw you, Bart.
yeah i don't know why you think that bart is reasonable. maybe because you do not commute from the east bay to sf every day, or go to the airport very often.
Bart is insanely overpriced. You can easily spend more than $200 a month if you take it every day.
But at least it's fast. Muni takes an hour and a half to get across the city. On Bart, you could cover three or four counties in that time period.
id rather drive
$8 one way per person to the airport for a 30-minute ride? Yikes. That will discourage couples with one older child because now a cab looks pretty economical and you don't have to haul your crap down the escalators and hope there is a space on the train for it.
I get screwed by this "sock it to the tourists" policy, because I primarily use BART to the airport, with an occasional Millbrae or Berkeley trip. I take at least 2-3 round trip flights per month. That means $10-$15 more for me...
At least the JFK airtrain offers a 50% discount if you buy a 10-ride ticket. I thought that one was a ripoff at $5 each way, especially when it's only $2 for the subway ride into Manhattan, which is much longer that the ride to SFO.
$8 is cheap compared to Heathrow Express (GBP 15), but Heathrow Express is ... an ... EXPRESS. BART to the airport takes twice as long as driving or a cab, and thanks to intentionally moronic designs sponsored by Quentin Kopp, Caltrain takes forever too.
Yes, and you still take the Piccadilly Line into the city centre for a more reasonable amount.
Even if you take Caltrain to Millbrae, you still get hit with the BART surcharge to get the last couple of miles into the airport itself.
BART to the airport from Civic Center = 30 minutes.
I've never gotten there in 15 by cab. More like 20.
BART is one of the best things about the Bay Area.
It's efficient, clean, fast, and almost as good as Google.
Apparently their police are a bit heavy-handed with the swarthy races, but you take the good with the bad.
The problem is when you're trying to use it for something other than commuting from the suburbs into the city you quickly find yourself either stranded in the middle of nowhere in the suburbs with little to no way to get anywhere unless someone else picks you up. BART works, but it just doesn't really go that many places.
Even in the city its only real use is to go from the Mission to Downtown. Yes, if you live near Balboa Park or Glen Park you can also take it, but you might as well be living in the suburbs at that point, especially as far as reasonable transit is concerned. I used to live down near the Daly City stop where they thoughtfully decided to put it just across the county line so a FastPass wouldn't work and it wouldn't really serve the majority of Daly City either. BART was pricier, but trying to take the M was asking for at least a 45-60 minute trip as it slowly tried to get up to West Portal through traffic despite the grade separation for a good chunk of the journey.
What all of it shows is that we really just need a proper subway in town. That is, one which doesn't run underground only along a very small section of town and then work just as badly as every other bus resulting in constant delays. Subways are the only reasonable answer to our transit nightmare.
"sock it to the tourists" - you mean sock it to SFO employees...
I thought SFO employees got a special discounted BART ticket that waived or discounted the SFO fees.
Also to note: While BART's minimum fare (intra-SF) will only be $1.75, that's still 25 cents cheaper than taking a hell ride through Muni for $2.
"even though both fares are still pretty damn cheap compared to other big cities"
What major cities are you comparing to? Please find below the price, as of today, for a single ride on a bus/train in each of the top ten cities in the United States based on population (sorted by population).
New York City 2.00
Los Angeles 1.25
Chicago 2.25
Houston 1.25
Phoenix 1.25
Philadelphia 2.00
San Antonio 1.10
San Diego 2.25
Dallas 1.50
San Jose 1.75
That would make the average price $1.66.
Most of these are going up. NYC won't be $2 for long. And a lot of these are not meaningful as almost nobody rides the system (Phoenix, Houston, Dallas).
Actually, most aren't going up, and those that are going up are only going up by 25 cents, which means the statement still won't be true. And you can't say that per capita we get the same quality of service as New York or Chicago.
What is your logical justification that the data "isn't meaningful" when it is clearly derived from the data set under investigation? Do you just want the statement to be true?
BTW, the only international city in the top ten I've found so far that is more than $2.00 for a one-way average bus/train ride is London. Tokyo, the largest city, is about $1.67.
Obligatory New Yorker reply: but look at what you get for your $2 plus: 24 hour service over 4 counties for the subway and 5 for the bus; trains and buses that serve residential neighborhoods; meaningful fare discounts when purchased in bulk.
And how many of these other cities have a "Transit First" policy?
NY MTA is going to $2.25 but right now it's $2. There's no comparison in the quality of the service though. MUNI is horrendous at $1.50 and even worse at $2.00 -- it's one of the few businesses that can raise the cost of its product while providing less. SF residents should stop accepting mediocrity.
After a cheap airfare induced vacation to Barcelona introduced me to how efficient, affordable, and intuitive a public transit system can be, I join others who feel a bit frustrated with how inefficient, unaffordable, and confusing MUNI and BART are to folks. Can we do a foreign exchange thing? Nat Ford can go to Barcelona for a year and we get their head transit person - and we provide the Barcelona person Emperor status - change what you like as long as it is intended to benefit the riders. Since Prop 13 turned the every day person away from paying attention to government and labor unions filled the void, all of these cluster fucks seem to stem from the fact that labor unions took over the elected commissioner positions and so on ... fuck everybody else. And they surely have, no?
It doesn't really matter who the executive is -- Nat Ford is reasonably competent, and hiring some random Catalan isn't going to improve the situation.
The London Underground was successfully rehabilitated by an American freight rail exec, for chrissake: http://www.christianwolmar.co.uk/2009/02/otoole-a-loss-for-londoners-and-mayor/
It's about the institutional culture and political roadblocks. The Tube has pride, Muni doesn't. And Gavin is constantly acting to undermine the system. To make Muni begin to work, we need a new mayor (and more money).
Obligatory, response from Boston snowbird: You forgot Boston, which is wicked reasonable at 1.70 for the T (subway) and 1.25 for the bus - they stick it to the tourists with a system that works, a "Charlie Card" that every local knows to have which reduces the fare (on the T a cash fare is $2.00). PLUS, you actually, you know, can get to where you need to go within 30 minutes or less (without getting spooged or vomited on). ALSO, the city has a winning baseball team. AND has equal rights for all. AND has Dunkin' Donuts...
and snow...
Would you fuck Boston's mayor?
Okay then.
I'd still trade Gavin to Boston for Menino and throw in 10 Mayoral staffers and a couple of players to be named later.
Unfortunately, for the majority of straight female and gay male voters, this was the only criteria considered when electing that useless sack of shit the first time and then again. Is the mayor a piece of ass. Great job, retards.
You people really have no shame at all. Anyone who voted for this joke, useless twit, absentee, showboat of a career politician needs a swift kick in the ass.
Wow. It's so easy to throw out assertions like "for the majority of straight female and gay male voters, this was the only criteria considered" that have no basis in fact when you're angry isn't it? Given this post and the one from you below where you say you are going to buy a car, I really hope you get some counseling to try and deal with all that anger. I'm mad at Muni too, but Jesus.
Cleverless? Really?
Cleverless? Really?
Thanks MUNI & BART, you have officially pushed the right combination of buttons to send me into purchasing a used vehicle. Your service is unreliable, your fees are unreasonable and you left me stranded so many times only to be forced into taking a cab and dropping yet more money on top of what I already pay you in advance to do.
When you do finally show up, I am presented with ill mannered morons, smelly people, fingernail clippers, junk food littering, pumpkin seed spitting cretins and the general dregs of society who should never be allowed to leave their primary place of residence.
I am dropping a few grand on a used beater - probably a Toyota or Honda - insuring it and becoming one of those single occupancy vehicles that litter the highway. I gave you a shot for the past 7 years when I decided to go car-less and you have utterly failed. Go ahead and raise the rates to 10 bucks for all I care. Done.
Have fun with street cleaning, and weekend evening parking.
Also, have you tried commenting at SFgate? You seem like a perfect fit.