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We had fantasized about joining City Car Share for years but could never front the $300 deposit. We had been intrigued by Zipcar but weren't motivated enough to sign up. Plus, they seemed expensive. So, when Flexcar (RIP) came about around the same time and were offering low rates and an insanely low membership fee of $36, we were onboard.
We enjoyed Flexcar while they lasted, and we hate to say that we might have played a part in their demise -- we damaged a vehicle (or two, maybe?). We reported it but nothing ever came about. Then Flexcar promptly merged with Zipcar. Zipcar offered us a membership for $50, all of which went toward driving credit. They had us hook, line, and sinker.
Image credit: Renee Ya
After the jump, we ask for your advice...
We've been with Zipcar since January, and it's been a very smooth ride. There are three lots within a block of our house and several more within three blocks. In our experience, the cars we've checked out are almost always in great condition and where they're scheduled to be. Except when certain members forget to tell their spouse (who is also a member) where they got the car, and the car gets parked in the wrong lot after a trip to Trader Joe's. Yes, this happened to us last week. Zipcar was very kind to waive the $50 fee once they saw how great of a customer we have been (and how much money we've spent in recent months). We also admit that we threatened to switch to City Car Share.
But now that we've looked at City Car Share's rates again, we're wondering, should we cough up that deposit? Their rates are way lower -- almost half the price at times, but they don't have as many locations near us, which means possibly not as many cars. A huge plus with Zipcar is that we were able to purchase a $75 damage waiver, which means we don't have a deductible for a year. We also like the idea of checking out Zipcars in other metropolitan areas. But, we've recently been driving Zipcar to Novato for a week here and there, which costs us $65 a pop, plus tax. (We supplement the cost by taking the bus up two days out of the week, which is a whole other post.) The same trip with City Car Share would cost us a very low $45 -- a $100 difference spread out over a week...
Thoughts, dear readers?
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I was a member of CCS for several years and enjoyed the service, no problems. There is one aspect I found to be shady. When I canceled my membership I was surprised to find out CCS did not return my deposit with any interest earned while it was presumably held in a bank account. I asked CCS about this and they said they do not return deposits with interest. Come on, even my landlord writes me a check every year for the interest earned on my security deposit and so do secured credit cards that require a deposit. Think about that, CCS is setting aside all of their members deposits and pocketing the interest earned. If you are a member of CCS for several years, your $300 deposit devalues due to inflation and in addition you lose the interest earned over that time. When I asked CCS about this they were unwilling to discuss this with me. Not cool, considering they are a non-profit.
When I need a car to get out of the city, I usually just rent with one of the Hertz Local Edition offices around the city. My typical cost for an entire 3 day weekend is around $100 (usually involving some coupon + discount), and not counting the cost of gas or parking in a structure (I live in one of those many areas of the city where street parking is extremely competitive).
I haven't investigated too deeply, but I've always had a feeling I get more for my dough from the traditional car rental agencies than I would from these car sharing services.
Even though Zipcar costs marginally more than CCS, they have cleaner, newer cars, in more locations. And when things go awry, their customer service has never left me disappointed. I've been a member for at least two years and things have been just peachy.
zip car has proved most reliable. never sat in, drove w/ CC.
Brock, you betrayer! We gave you a ride home in a City CarShare that time!
The choice between the two? It depends on your driving habits and on the proximity of cars.
I took our last three months of City CarShare (which has 32 cars within a mile of our house in the Mission - and 12 of those are within 2 blocks) and calculated what it would have cost us using Zipcar.
If we spent $250/month on Zipcar (their least expensive plan, per hour) the rate would be $7.86/hr weekdays and $8.29/hr weekends. Premium cars are more. There's no fee for mileage, so if you drive long distances, that's a plus. But if you spend less (say, $125 a month), the cost per hour is significantly higher.
With lower hourly rates City CarShare would seem a lot cheaper, but they charge for mileage. Even so, our City CarShare usage averaged out to only $7.25/hr -- and we drive to the East Bay and to Palo Alto pretty frequently, although most of our trips are in SF and under 10 miles. With our plan, we don't pay extra for a premium car.
There's an additional difference. Zipcar is like your cell phone plan: you buy the minutes, if you don't use them, they roll over for a couple of months. With City CarShare, you pay only for the hours you use. So if your usage is variable, that's a plus.
Also, City CarShare is a non-profit, and has lower-cost programs for qualifying low-income participants. We feel good about that.
That last comment wasn't inflammatory enough. What I meant to say was: Zipcar is for people who are afraid of the word "share."
Sorry, Dana.
$250 / month on Zipcar? Wha? You can get an occasional driving plan and not pay any money per month, just a $50 annual fee. This is what I've got, but I admittedly drive very infrequently (I live right in the middle of the city and bike a lot). For me Zipcar winds up being marginally more expensive than just renting a car, although the gap is narrowing somewhat as gas prices rise. Overall it's worth it just for the convenience of dropping the car off right next to my house, but if there weren't a lot of lots nearby parking lots for them I'd probably cancel my account.
CCS seems like a great idea, and as a nonprofit I'd rather support them, but I can't really justify paying out $10 / month when I often go several months without driving at all.
I've been a member of CCS for five years. I don't pay for gas, insurance, or maintenance. The cars are never very sexy, but I don't care about that; it's all about getting from A to B. My wife and I are moderate users (1-2 grocery runs a month and a few one-hour rentals to give her a ride to work when she has to open early mornings) and our monthly bill averages around $130. Not bad.
I've never used ZipCar and have nothing bad to say about them. I took a look at them when they first came to town and their prices seemed too high.
Besides being a non-profit, I'm pretty sure CCS is local, whereas ZipCar isn't. I know that isn't a great argument, but hey, why not? :)
SFist_Jonathan, it was? Oh man, I couldn't remember which we were in. For obvious reasons.
OK, I like both. I mean, you know, for someone who is afraid to drive, that is.
Ok, to start out I must admit I know nothing about City Car Share. I do however have experience with local rental agencies and I'm a member of ZipCar.
That said....ZipCars are always clean, always functional, good customer service and a wide variety of makes and models - many with no advertising on them for the dl, I have no deposit, insurance and gas is included and I can do a day trip up/down the coast with the 180 miles included with the reservation, and I can pick up the car any time day or night, reserved on a website, in any number of dozens of locations in the city, a dozen witin blocks of my apartment alone. AND when I travel to other cities, there they are: Nashville, Santa Cruz, Seattle, Santa Barbara, SmelLA, Philly, Toronto, Vancouver, Boston, New York (though I can't imagine driving there) AND London, plus a dozen plus others.
Got troubles, damage...call them. Report a broken tail-light, fixed the next day. Trasmission probs, replace the whole car, last person left the floor mats dirty, cleaned the next morning.
Rates are low, no deposit, charge-offs rollover, etc., etc. Nobody has mentioned any such features of these others.
ZipCar rawks without you.
The main thing I didn't like about ZipCar was how if you wanted to rent a car for more than, I think, six hours, you might as well rent it for 24, because it's cheaper. And of course most of the time, a lot of those 24 hours are going to be spent with the car parked in its spot, so it seems like they should offer some kind of 1/2 rate after hours or something...not sure if CCS is any different.
And also, most cars were getting to be over 70 bucks for a daily rental, and that's a lot, even if gas is included. And yeah, I know, the main purpose of the whole car sharing thing seems to be for running city errands and the like. But sometimes you want to get a lot done in one day, and three hours ain't gonna cut it.
And while I had a lot very close to me, I could very rarely get a car on a whim on the weekends. I'd have to plan at least a week ahead.
I am a CCS member because my employer has some deal with them (so if you work somewhere sizable, check and see if you company is a member, or ask you company to talk to CCS about making a deal with them) that we don't have to pay the deposit.
CCS has been great for us. The cars are always functional, the news ScionXDs have iPod connectors in them, and there are two places to pick up cars very close to where I live.
I have a friend who works events for Zip Car, and he's a member of Zip Car and loves it.
I used to use CCS a few years ago. The mileage charges made it highly cost ineffective for any long trip. But it was damn convenient.
Also depends on whom you work for . . . because of my employer, my annual fee with CCS is only $25 making it a much better option than Zip. I also live within two blocks of three CCS locations.
I only use Zipcar for work (have not yet used CCS) but I've had great experiences with them, especially in terms of customer service. That said, it's not my money.
Wow, check the huge Zipcar banner ad right next to this post.
I don't know anything about City Car Share, so I can't speak to their service. I do know, however, that Zipcar has multiple lots within blocks of me, has pickup trucks and Elements when I need to make an ikea run, Prius when I'm feeling super-smug, and a mini cooper convertible.
I'm happy with them. Although lately every friggin car I've picked up from them is hovering on 1/4 tank, making it necessary for me to fill the car up before returning it, which is kind of irritating. There's no reason for a car to be sitting that low on gas at 7 a.m., but whatever.
I'm a loyal member of CCS since practically the beginning. (I just bit the bullet and paid the $300... it's totaly been worth it.)
They're cheaper than Zipcar, they're local, and they're a non-profit. All things in their favor, I think. I've always had great customer service (including the time I locked my keys in the car at 10pm and somebody had to come out and unlock it for me).
Not getting interest on my deposit doesn't bother me at all. They're a non-profit, I just consider it a donation.
But when it comes down to it, they're both allowing us to live without owning a car, so they're both good in my book!
They're a non-profit, I just consider it a donation.
Wow. I sometimes think people think "non-profit" means "Mother Theresa." Rarely the case.
Whenever I'm stuck behind someone taking an age to make a left turn, the perp is invariably driving a car from one of these companies. This service does seem to attract the more sheepish of motorist. Is it because you don't drive often? The pedal on the right is the go pedal.
If you're taking a lot of long trips, CityCarShare could be a bad choice. They charge roughly 50 cents a mile.
However, they do have the Extended Freedom trips. They're 40 bucks for 24 hours, +10 cents a mile. You can do that 4 times a year, or 10 times a year (+you can purchase extra) if you go with CityCarShare Plus, which is an extra $10/month with really no other benefit beyond the extra Extended trips.
That might sound like kind of a raw deal, but it's what I do, and it works out fine. The Extended trips are kind of cool-- I grabbed a pickup truck for 24 hours and picked up stuff all over the peninsula.
Last month in Zipcar:
3 hour trip through Marin in a Mini
at $10.58/hr, plus tax: $34.44
2.5 hour trip to Brisbane in a Prius
at $6.30/hr, plus tax: $17.09
Total: $51.53
-------
Had it been through City Carshare:
3 hour / 25 mile trip through Marin in a Mini
at $7.00/hr, plus $0.40/mile: $31.00
2.5 hour / 12 mile trip to Brisbane in a Prius
at $5.00/hr, plus $0.40/mile: $17.30
Subtotal: $48.30
Add Tax (is there tax?): $52.40
Plus $10.00/mo.
Total: $62.40
-------
Was that all correct?
Also, there are more variables to consider, including the City Carshare "night owl" rates, the extended trip thing, etc. etc.
As someone who rarely does "around town" driving and who basically wants a car for day trips, Zipcar's rate structure seems a bit more suitable.
I used to just rent cars, but the prices were only marginally better (when they were better) and the experience was never pleasant. Zipcar sometimes seems like an extravagance, but, eh, it's cool.
Wow. I sometimes think people think "non-profit" means "Mother Theresa." Rarely the case.
I don't mean that at all. It's just that whatever amount the interest would be doesn't matter that much to me, and because it's something I believe in, I don't mind them getting the interest. Nothing deeper than that.
It doesn't necessarily mean "Mother Theresa", but it means no one is taking your interest home with them. It all gets put back into whatever it is the non-profit does.
Sure, and there's no profit like non-profit of course.
I've been a City Car Share member for about six years. The cars are always clean, they're everywhere, the tanks are always 1/2 full and sometimes, every so often, someone leaves a custom road mix CD for other members in the glove box.
Additionally, City Car Share is a non-profit dedicated to improving life in the Bay Area by reducing car ownership. ZipCar is a for profit company. No matter what the math comes out to, I'll always be a City Car Share member.
I have been with CCS for about a year. Back when I signed up I checked online for reviews of Zip Car and CCS.
Back then I found a lot of complaints about Zip Car so I went with CCS.
Generally has been a good experience. But I am surprised that so many of CCS cars are banged up. Seems that the drivers are not all that good because they don't drive much.
That's a hassle because when I do a walk-around of the vehicle before driving, it takes extra time to look things over and compare all the damage with what is on the sheet that shows existing damage.
Also, many CCS members are crappy in terms of sticking with the rules. Twice I had to fill up cars that had less than 1/2 tank.
One time a person had used a parking lot ticket to enter the lot [not supposed to do that, supposed to use a card that is in the vehicle]. Took me about 15 minutes to be allowed to exit because the lot attendant was freaking out. And he read me the riot act on having a ticket when I was not the one who made the error.
Damage is the big issue though. I'd say 8 out of 10 cars have body damage, one was a new car with a cigarette burn in the middle of the seat, etc. I have not seen where CCS fixes the cars and instead makes up piss away 10 minutes inspecting the cars before we can start using them.
I haven't done it yet, but I've looked into it and when I finally join one I think I'll end up going with CCS only because it suits my purposes more than ZipCar - it's looking like both have their advantages and disadvantages and overall neither one is superior, it's just all about what your needs are.
I'd never use either one for long-distance rentals though.
I've been using ZipCar for a year or two, and have been very happy. I actually joined in disgust right after renting a car at one of the downtown places and having to wait two hours because several people had returned their cars late. Being able to walk to the corner and pick up a car is, in my opinion, worth paying a bit more for a two- or three-day rental.
fizzandpop: I suspect a lot of the slow driving has to do with driving an unfamiliar car on streets you probably don't drive very much. At least that's why I tend to drive slower than I did back when I had my own car ....
Back to post #1, your landlord sends you a check for interest on your deposit every year? Never heard of such a thing!
This has been a very helpful thread everyone. Thanks!
xyz123, landlords are supposed to send you the money accrued via interest on your deposit because they're only allowed to retain a max of 150% of your rent as a security deposit.
Re interest on security deposits, San Francisco landlords pay you that interest because it is mandated by rent control laws that they do so.
The interest rate is also mandated. I doubt that they keep your security deposit in a savings account, at what, 1%? None that I know of do.
I don't have any opinion on Zip-car or CCS as I have always owned a car, since I was 18.
CCS recently started offering 24-hr "extended freedom" trips, for $40 a day / 10ยข a mile. It's really been a smart move, as it allows people to get out of town every once in awhile (which used to be very expensive with CSS).
I've been a member for a couple of years and have always been impressed with their customer support, and their service in general. Plus, I think the non-profit vs. for-profit argument is a valid one. Go CCS!
Everywhere is pretty subjective. They are everywhere in the Northeast quadrant and the Mission. Head outside of that and you'll quickly find that both companies dry up to almost nothing. I was actually amazed to find that both apparently have a lot near where I live as I've never seen them.
Once again if you don't live in one of the cool parts of town you're pretty much screwed and ignored. That said, it totally sucks to live in Oceanview and I wouldn't wish it on anyone.
...i'm sure the fact that zipcar is an advertiser on sfist in no way affected the photograph decision or the content of this story...
as an early employee and volunteer at City Carshare, i know that a lot of really great people gave a pantload of time, money, blood, sweat, and tears to make carsharing happen in this town when private industry wouldn't touch it.
and we weren't alone -- toronto, portland, vancouver, montreal, philadelphia, and many others had thriving, local, independent carsharing operations that proved to everyone that it was viable somewhere besides europe.
ultimately competition is a good thing even though businesses of all types usually wish they didn't have any :)
certainly rates, car types, insurance options, and car locations have improved now that zipcar is in town, but probably the best thing about the competition is the fact that now all of the independents are having to think globally as well as locally. for example, you can use your City Carshare membership in Copenhagen, Sydney, Chicago, Philadelphia, and others... http://www.citycarshare.org/roaming.do
Thanks for the info, Brianna.
...i'm sure the fact that zipcar is an advertiser on sfist in no way affected the photograph decision or the content of this story...
Since I've only had experience with Zipcar, I could only review their service. Hence, the photo. As far as the content, did you actually read the post? The pros and cons of both companies were addressed.
Yes, Zipcar is an advertiser, and I am an unpaid blogger...