January 7, 2008
NYC Mugging Leads to Safer SF Relocation?
Festishizing that "authentic, old-school New York experience," Adam Fisher moved to NYC to frolic with hipsters, sing selections from Rent, or snap his fingers to the jazzy beats along with the other bohemian artists when he moved to Bushwick, Brooklyn. Unfortunately, his time there was a bit too real. Severely beaten and mugged of $28 while at the Morgan Avenue L subway station, Fisher hightails it back to his hometown, San Francisco. In his jarring piece for New York Magazine ("The Bleeding Edge"), he goes into graphic detail and explains his move back West.
Within 24 hours of my release from the hospital, I made it back to San Francisco, where I grew up; within 48 hours, I decided to quit my job and move back there ... I carry a knife now, a small utility blade that I picked up at the hardware store. And when friends of mine get nostalgic for the bad old days, when lofts were cheap and New York was edgy, I tell them that it’s all still there, if you know where to look.
Having twice experience the not-so-gentle hands of a violent mugger ourselves, we feel for Fisher. We do. But why back to San Francisco, where crime is making a fearless comeback?
Oh, and a commenter going by the moniker "poopmast," on Gothamist's post of the same subject, declares that "I lived in SF for a bit and believe me SF is more dangerous because they let the homeless roam freely and follow you home, whereas they get nypd beatings to keep them in check here."
How lovely. Anyway, although we disagree on SFPD-sanctioned torture on the homeless, this begs the question: is SF safer than NYC?
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I can just picture this guy as a puppy, tail between his legs "yarping" his way back home.
One measly mugging and he leaves the city? I'm thinking a lot of things here, all of them snarky.
The city you know is always safer, you know the neighborhoods, streets etc, and the inkling of what is not right,
Yep, I read his post on gothamist earlier today (work? What's that?)... As an NYC native living in the Bay Area for 15 years, I have to say that NYC is more dangerous, period. The homeless population in NYC has been beaten down, maybe literally but certainly figuratively; I never had as many homeless make eye contact with me in NYC as have here. So what? It's better that people are beaten down and totally hopeless? Though another part of me smiles smugly at Fisher running away from the big bad city where he got a little dusty.
And Adam? Your tiny knife is worse than useless; someone with more training than you (which could even be my new puppy from the sounds of things) is going to take it away from you and use it on you.
Oh, and to give one final contradictory feeling voice, I'm glad the tweeder left my hometown. We/They don't need transplants destroying the old neighborhoods in the boroughs.
Bushwick is only one small part of NYC. I lived on the Upper East Side for over 20 years (a lot of that pre-Giuliani) and was never mugged. Only when I moved to Queens was I groped on the street and subject to an apartment break-in. As an Upper-East-Sider, NY is safer. As a Queens resident, SF is safer. As someone who works in SOMA...you get my point.
Oh wow-- when I first read the article on Gothamist, I didn't pay attention to all the negative commenters (how many times was Adam called a "douche"? At least 5? For what?) Now I come here expecting a little more support for the home boy and see the same negativity.
What's up people? Can you really imagine cities like NY or SF without transplants being better off? Some of us are not blessed by being born into the cool, pre-gentrified neighborhoods. Moving to a new city is hard, terrifying in fact, and I feel for the guy and wish him all the best.
bebycik, i do feel for adam. especially since sf is (reportedly) his hometown. i had to be talked out of moving back home to OC after i was mugged (or, in fact, whenever i have the slightest hint of a bad day), but he made the right decision as far as i can tell.
i don't know why people are calling him a douche. he carries around a knife out of paranoia, which deserves some sort of compassion. ideally, i think.
Oh, and to give one final contradictory feeling voice, I'm glad the tweeder left my hometown.
We're glad you're staying there, dearie. I'm sure one day people will stop moving there and it will just be natives and finally, finally everything in NYC will be as amazingly great as the Williamsburg hipsters pretend it actually is. (I'm sure NYC is the center of some universe, but despite what New Yorkers think, it isn't this one.)
One measly mugging and he leaves the city? - Yeah, people should be able to shake off brutal beatings like they the sprained their ankle, right? Rapes and muggings, they're funny, right? Strangers abusing you is teh funny, see? HA HA! N00B! U R MUGZ0R3d!
@ badedukation: dude, I said it was contradictory. I do feel bad that he was mugged. But at some level, I buy into the tougher-than-thou feeling New Yorkers grow up with. I've been mugged, but did I run away to Podunk, PA?
If you're interested in what's inside my tweeder comment, check out Queens Crap
I think that everyone should move back to wherever it is they came from. And please don't stop at the place where your momma gave birth to you, go one step further and head back to where your ancestors originated. Stop integrating and spreading yourselves around, think backwards and build bigger walls, deeper moats and surround them with more fire breathing dragons! buhahaha! ; )
I've been in SF for a year and a half (4 months in the Lower Haight, the rest across the street from Lilly's BBQ in the Western Addition). Prior to that my entire life was spent living in Queens and Brooklyn. In 28 years in New York I was mugged twice (one was a failed attempt). Since moving here I've almost come to blows with crazy or ghetto people at least 5 times & witnessed 1 of the 4 shootings that happened across the street from me in broad daylight during the summer. Doesn't reflect well on SF, yet I don't think I could ever move back to New York.
We/They don't need transplants destroying the old neighborhoods in the boroughs. - KatyG - I don't think it's very fair to be a transplant yourself (albeit from NYC to SF, the land of transplants) and say NYC doesn't need transplants.
RobinSF: I'd love to move back to the land of my ancestors, particuarly if any of the GOP forerunners make it in, since they scare the shit out of me. But hey, Europe does not want Americans. I love how people do the "love it or leave it" thing, but then fail to realize how difficult getting citizenship in other countries actually is. ;-)
I lived in New York for a year when I was 18 and I have to say I was always surprised how safe Manhattan felt. I was ok with walking home alone at 3 am on several occasions (and I'm a girl), whereas I probably wouldn't do that in SF except in really safe and boring residential areas. I never went wandering alone at night in the boroughs, though.
I sandwiched 3 years in Oakland around multiple years here in New York, and i have to say, I've always felt safer in NY than I ever did in Oakland or the nightlife areas of SF.
Oakland is full of dark, deserted streets that really get your guard up as you walk around.
New York, unless you are hanging out in isolated parts of the outer boroughs, you're walking with crowds. This doesn't guarantee you won't get mugged, but it certainly reduces the chances.
@ TheCharlie: yes, that's why I said it was contradictory. I'm not thrilled that I feel this way. On the other hand, I have not tried to gentrify the place I moved to.
manhattan is way safer and cleaner than san francisco. no argument there. the boroughs, anything goes. kind of like the hoods here. so we both have our shithole parts of town. where did he move back to?
Look at the crime statistics. San Francisco has more crime than Manhattan nowadays by far. Newsom was even saying for awhile that he was going to start a brand spanking new anti-crime program modeled after New York City's successful one. Am guessing that plan, like most of Newsom's other plans, probably got stuck somewhere in a committee made up of his inept cronies.
KatyG what neighborhood do you live in? How are you any less an interloper than Adam Fisher?
=v= Bushwick is definitely the bleeding edge ... of gentrification. I love Brooklyn but I also honor it.
I share a home in both cities and as I type this right now I'm looking out over mid-town Manhattan. I'll be back home in SF on Thursday evening. Needless to say, I feel safer in New York. I'm not quite sure why but I've never been mugged or accosted here in anyway and I've been into some of the rougher parts of the 5 burroughs. I'm a single female who often travels alone. However, I've been accosted twice just outside the Metreon on Mission on my way to the parking garage in broad daylight. Having obscenities screamed at me by a 6'4" tranny in a fur, while having my change demanded of me resulted in my own poor public behaviour and violence because enough was enough. Even the homeless in Berkeley have "made a pass" at me. WTF SF?
Oh and a side note about Oakland? I'm African American and there's parts of Oakland even I won't go into. Straight hood!!!! No way in hell.
this guy wanted to be part of the "pre-gentrified New York." and that's exactly what he got in a neighborhood that he was gentrifying. what the hell did he expect. the tales of people getting mugged in the streets of manhattan 20 years ago exist for a reason.
I agree with tien mao. "pre-gentrified" = scary, dangerous ghetto. That's what he wanted, and that's what he got.
I can't compare SF to NYC, but I will say that I feel far safer in SF than I did in my horrid red state city. I've been all over this city at all hours of the day and night, and I've never really felt afraid. And I'm a girl. Maybe I've just been lucky.
OK, that one time I was on sixth and market and saw that dude get shot, that was a little unnerving. But other than that...
zig: I live in Pacifica and I have never felt the need to make any changes in what makes Pacifica what it is. I live there because I get for free things not even Trump could buy in NYC.
Hey corsini: I'd be interested to know if you gave a statement to sfpd about your witnessing the shooting, or if you are just contributing to the problem by staying quiet. Oh, and I only remember 3 taking place there.
I live in both cities, and they really do seem different as far as crime is concerned, but I won't bore you with my own stories. There's a site that has FBI crime statistics, which are outdated (surprise, it's the government) but not too too bad (post-911 and post-dotcom-bubbleburst). It shows that in 2003, on a per capita basis, the rate for all violent crimes (murder, rape, assault & robbery) in SF was 1.24 times the national average, and in NY was 1.23 times. That's a tie. And for property crime, SF is 1.12 times the national average, while NY is at .49. Wow, SF certainly sucks on those (burglary, larceny/theft, car theft & arson). Maybe it's because NYers have such small apartments they have fewer belongings to steal and fewer cars... or maybe it's that SFans are more willing to actually report crimes under the illusion that the SFPD might actually do something?
cityrating. com/citycrime.asp?city=New+york&state=NY
cityrating. com/citycrime.asp?city=San+Francisco&state=CA
Go Giuliani!