SFist: MacArthur Maze Collapses

Alex (the other one)

Mon, 30 Apr 2007 15:10:36 -0800

Rail is nice and all, but don't forget that rail will not solve the problem of operator error. Think that you can never go too fast around a bend in a train? Ask MUNI how they managed to destroy one of their brand spanking new $3mil streetcars a few years back.

Jamison

Mon, 30 Apr 2007 14:08:38 -0800

The story reported this was fuel heading to be processed, not to gas stations. Did that turn out to be a mistake in the early reporting?

nose

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 18:55:11 -0800

Michael: Just to clarify, I am NOT supportive of Mormon leader/apostle mark E. Petersen's views on minorities. I find them reprehensible. It was just one very small example of how the Mormons' history is selectively told by those in power to PBS. There are lots of others. Don't even get me started on their bizzare past temple rituals.

mcgordonliddy

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 17:19:17 -0800

I'd like to second that Dukes of Hazzard ramp idea.

smushmoth

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 17:18:16 -0800

uh, there are plenty of reasons to use rail, but this isn't an example of one of them. While the rails could probably come straight from the refinery (they may already have rail), where do they unload the fuel to go to the gas stations? Benicia isn't all that far from Oakland. Do they have a pumping and storage facility in every town? Do you want one near your home or your kids school? Plus if this was a train wreck there would have been 90,000 gallons not 9,000 spilled. Their are also much easier/cheaper ways to move high volume liquids, pipelines. As for the repair time, if this was an elevated rail that melted away another elevated rail above it, it would certainly take in the same range of time to repair. Then again, I am pretty sure all the rail lines are privately owned, thus it would probably be fixed in about 1/10th the time.

Jeffrey W. Baker

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 17:10:18 -0800

Actually, it's just a lot more expensive and difficult to built freeways than railroads. Railroads are very standard, narrow, and have known specifications. The are all alike, except BART, but that's material for another comment. You can lay tracks even on a bridge in no time. Freeways require scaffolding, molding, complicated aerial concrete pours, surface work, striping, vertical crash barriers, and they are very wide compared to a railroad. Nonetheless, I expect Caltrans is really going to jump on this quickly. If the lower ramp has been damaged they can demolish it and work around the clock.

N

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 17:02:33 -0800

I think Union Pacific can get stuff like that done so quickly because they don't have the construction limitations of freeways. No doubt to replace this, the other parts of the maze need to be closed, which can only be done early in the morning. If they could work 'round the clock, maybe a month or so...but they can't.

Mark Ballew

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 16:33:49 -0800

To add to Jamison's comment, if this was a rail tanker explosion, the rail would be replaced in days, not months. Take the mystery blaze in Sacramento a few weeks ago for example, Union Pacific had the elevated tracks up in running in only a few days. Bart has increased capacity by a whopping 50% for tomorrow's commuters; check bart.gov for more details. AC Transit says they are already maxed out.

Michael

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 16:26:10 -0800

How many sections are damaged? It looks like two, max. Why not just put a Dukes of Hazzard style launch ramp for cars to leap over the gaping hole in the road? I'd expect most cars (except anything made by V.W.) would make it. It'd be even cooler if they had Dixie horns playing while making the jump, too. p.s. what's up with that bizzare "Mormon" comment up there?

Jamison

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 15:48:01 -0800

Remember that rail just isn't for transporting people around. Every day there are tankers like this and all the other big rigs carrying dangerous materials on crowded highways which could be carried more safely, efficiently and with less pollution by train instead. With California High-Speed Rail we could improve transit and take cargo vehicles off the roads at the same time, that means less traffic for you drivers. Many of the grade separated crossing which would be built would by used for both freight and passenger trains.

nose

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 15:22:42 -0800

Interesting ad on the left there. But I have found that official Mormon sources are notorious for the parts of their history that they actively ignore or even deny. A better source for unbiased info is at lds-mormon DOT com. for example, it's interesting that Mormon apostle Mark E. Petersen said in the 50s about interracial marraige/segregation: "God has commanded Israel not to intermarry. To go against this commandment of God would be in sin. Those who willfully sin with their eyes open to this wrong will not be surprised to find that they will be separated from the presence of God in the world to come. This is spiritual death...." "The reason that one would lose his blessings by marrying a Negro is due to the restriction placed upon them. "No person having the least particle of Negro blood can hold the Priesthood" (Brigham Young). It does not matter if they are one-sixth Negro or one-hundred and sixth, the curse of no Priesthood is the same. If an individual who is entitled to the Priesthood marries a Negro, the Lord has decreed that only spirits who are not eligible for the Priesthood will come to that marriage as children. To intermarry with a Negro is to forfeit a "Nation of Priesthood holders".... and even more interesting (emphasis mine): "Now we are generous with the Negro. We are willing that the Negro have the highest education. *I would be willing to let every Negro drive a Cadillac if they could afford it.* (!) I would be willing that they have all the advantages they can get out of life in the world. But let them enjoy these things among themselves. I think the Lord segregated the Negro and who is man to change that segregation?"

smushmoth

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 13:48:52 -0800

He had second degree burns, he needed to get to the hospital. He most likely did call the cops, as how was it known that he called a cab, or what hospital he went to unless he alerted the authorities. It's not like the fire could have been extinguished, the gas needed to burn off.

Mike

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 13:37:34 -0800

@Cor, shock maybe? Who knows. We hardly have the facts at this point.

bluecanary

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 13:33:33 -0800

If this is what it takes to get more people riding mass transit, then I say let's turn loose a cadre of methed-out, gas transporting truckers.

Lo

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 13:31:46 -0800

"The tanker, loaded with 8,600 gallons of unleaded gasoline, was heading from a refinery in Benicia to a gas station on Hegenberger Road, in Oakland, shortly before 4 a.m. when it crashed" Tanker fire destroys part of MacArthur Maze / 2 freeways closed near Bay Bridge

Jamison

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 13:26:40 -0800

This demonstrates to terrorists they'll never top what we can do to ourselves. This isn't a good time for BART riders because the influx of added riders will fill trains past capacity though it demonstrates why we should have more rail rapid transit.

Cor

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 13:13:32 -0800

Is there a reason he didn't call 911 and alert the FD and PD rather than calling a cab?? Why haven't we heard more about the driver and who he was transporting gasoline for?

MattyMatt

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 12:09:44 -0800

Also: now would be an excellent opportunity to rebuild the damn thing so that it is NOT A FUCKING MAZE.

MattyMatt

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 12:03:45 -0800

Holy crap! Sure is a good time to be a BART user. Andrew's got an interesting point. I wonder how difficult it would be for an evildoer to get a tanker full of gasoline? Very, I hope.

andrew

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 11:57:43 -0800

Just imagine if this has been intentional rather than an accident...

D

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 11:50:04 -0800

if she's accurate, i was close http://susiebright.blogs.com/photos/uncategorized/2007/04/29/google_map.jpg

D

Sun, 29 Apr 2007 11:37:46 -0800

is this the exact location of collapsed span?latitude: 37.827548, longitude: -122.293099