March 20, 2007
Pedestrian Killed on Valencia Street by Asshole Driver
From what we understand, the Quentin Tarantino portion of his Grindhouse movie is about a stunt driver who goes a little crazy and starts running over people. Which sounds kind of dumb and makes us wish Quentin would stop slumming around and get back to making great movies again. But in reading about the below story, we're starting to think Quentin might be into something because this story, about a pedestrian being killed in anger by a car driver on Valencia Street, is darn right awful.
The story goes that around 2 last night, while SFist was sound asleep nearby, a car tried to make a left turn from Valencia onto 16th Street when he encountered two people trying to cross. Words were exchanged and the driver got out to continue the confrontation. He got back into the car and started driving after the two pedestrians. When one of them hit the car in anger, the driver proceeded to drive up and onto the sidewalk, killing one of the two people.
That, as they say, is insane.
The driver has been arrested and is awaiting charges.
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just goes to show you, it don't make sense to engage in confrontations with anyone. especially late night.
you never know who you are dealing with. or what substance they are dealing with.
if you wanna fight, go to the dojo. police station is 1 block from there?
The phrases "left turn," "16th and Valencia," and "confrontation between driver and pedestrian" appear together all too often - killing someone because of this is fortunately quite rare - was the driver from out of town/unfamiliar with the area?
Not an excuse for such egregious behavior, but it makes me wonder. I've learned through years of experience, that as a driver, one must take a zen-like approach to that intersection.
A$$hole seems like the wrong word to describe the perpetrator, dont you think? I mean, the guy who snuck ahead of me and stole my spot in the Safeway parking lot is an a$$hole. We're talking about someone who ran someone else down in cold blood...
I hoped road rage wouldn't filter down to us pedestrians. This town's hell on us walkers...
The person got did because he smash the dudes windshield. By doing this the smasher was the first aggressor.Now the aggressor didn't deserve death but maybe an ass whipping,but not death.But we and in a supposed civil society where we call the cops instead of taking justice in our own hands.
agreed - picking a fight like that is not smart business in just about every case, unless you're extremely confident/talented/athletic/etc., and if the person you're with is all of those things, too.
put the dude in jail for the rest of his life. end of story.
> put the dude in jail for the rest of his life. end of story.
> Why? That neighborhood needs cleaning up.
Yes, from assholes like this. No excuse for reckless driving. (In my hood we had a few guys like this years ago, and fortunately they all seem to have been caught.)
"egregious behavior"?
"road rage"?
"reckless driving"?
it's odd that the these terms are used. it almost seems that there is underlying sympathy for the driver. the correct term that is missing from this board is "murder". second degree murder to be exact. odd.
Frankly, I'm surprised it has taken so long. We all need to work together, but judging by the way some pedestrians take their sweet time crossing streets in a direct effort to thumb their noses at motorists, I am surprised this does not happen more often. Hurry up and cross the fucking street rather than trying to hold up traffic. For a city that likes to compare itself to NY, these pedestrians would never have the courage to try that stuff in NY. By the way, this is no way excuses the motorist who just committed murder.
SF94118 is right. Don't you know he has someplace VERY IMPORTANT to be? Everyone, scurry across the road as fast as you can! Mustn't make him sit in his seat for a second longer than he has to!
Well, that's only the second murder of the day... I guess the third this week.. Ugh. Are we up to 30 yet?
Peds should walk faster, that's true. But it depends on whether the pedestrian is crossing legally or not. If legally, let them cross, it's the law. If illegally (imagine drunk guys on Sixth) lean on the horn, and demand that the police actually write jaywalking tickets.
But there is obviously no excuse for running someone down. I agree, second degree murder.
Did the pedestrian *smash* the guy's windshield, as someone said in the comments? Or did he just SMACK the car? I thought he just smacked it.
Anyhow, no matter how confrontational I get with asshole drivers (and to be honest, it's usually Marina style bimbos with their ears glued to phones. I'm not too worried about them murdering me), I would *never* do this in that neighborhood at that time of night. Not that this excuses the drivers actions, not by a longshot. I'm just saying not even my hot-tempered bitch self would try this.
I hope this guy's prison sentence is rectally painful on a daily basis.
No, the pedestrian in question did NOT "smash the dude's windshield." The article says he "punched" the driver's car. World of a difference there.
From the likes of Jerry Jarvis' post, it seems he not only has trouble speaking English, but reading it as well.
Actually, pedestrians always have the right of way, even if they are jaywalking. So don't just lean on the horn, also hit the brakes.
I know walkers can be total dicks, but a walking dick endangers mostly himself. When drivers are routinely ignorant of the possibility pedestrians might be about, their tiny inactions become life-threatening. At the corner of Mission and South Van Ness, I would estimate that every third driver making a right turn (either with the signal or against it) does so without ever actually looking right, thus failing to see people who are starting to cross, legally, in either direction. Does that make sense? Sorry, it's difficult to write out this geometrically simple scenario.
Of this set of right-turners, I would venture that one in two, having accelerated while still staring off to the left, then lurching to a halt when they finally face forward to find a pedestrian in their path...one in two is not apologetic, but indignant.
In the city's most pedestrian-intense intersections, those downtown, the walking mass is difficult to ignore. In the pedestrian-absent intersections of the outer city, there are no pedestrians for ignorant drivers to hit. It is in the middle ground of the Mission, and neighborhoods like it, that the situation seems worst.
Even when a driver is surprised to almost be smashing into me at the corner of Mission and South Van Ness I am reluctant be upset with them. Can you blame them for going so readily? The curb has such a wide, smooth arc. It invites a seamless vehicular turn, it suggests that to stop and look would be a shame.
Oh, but this guy at 16th and Valencia, he is a murderer, excuseless.
Related?: I was once walking through Hayes Valley and arrived at the corner of Grove and Laguna to find an SUV in the center of the intersection, blocking traffic both ways. It was night, and I could not make out the driver's face, could not tell if he was looking to stay or go. I waited a bit, edged out into the intersection, and as soon I was in front of the fellow he hit the gas and began speeding towards me. Just as quick, he slammed on the brakes, narrowly un-killing me. He then called me a faggot and sped off again.
I can understand why people here are suggesting that, for one's safety, one avoid confrontation. But what to do when confronted with something fast, heavy, and angry?
Tad - what you are describing in Hayes Valley is basically a jerk/redneck/prick who is seeking confrontation. On the other hand, while pedestrians do have the right of way, I do get tired of their attitude of ownership over the streets - their walking slowly across the street essentially taunting the driver who has to sit and wait while this loser crosses. I am both a pedestrian and motorist, and while crossing streets, I tend to hustle, both for my safety and in order to accomodate the flow of traffic and motorist.
In the case of the grove/Laguna incident, did you get the license number? That's a reckless driving ticket for sure. (You might want to report anonymously, it being the projects and all.)
from what I understand (mostly from cops and friends being run over) pedestrians do not always have the right of way. for instance, say, jaywalking. which is also crossing against the light as well as in the middle of the road. i had a friend who got drunk and wandered into the road and got smacked by some poor kid driving his car at the speed limit. she got a ticket. and a hospital stay.
hey, did you kow that if a pedestrian with headphones is going to step into the road (say, in order to cross it), they are required by law to only have ONE headphone in?
SF94118 -- are you kidding? "Loser" pedestrians are "taunting" you by walking slowly across the street? Consider that some of them may have physical problems which are not apparent, and remember that we're talking about a FEW SECONDS of your time.
Walker - I knew that somebody would point out the person who has a physical disability, etc. Of course I am not talking about that person, what I am talking about are the assholes who intentionally walk slowly in an effort to thumb their nose at the motorist. So no, I am not kidding at all.
Agreed Walker, "loser pedestrian" is such the wrong language. The fact of the matter is you cross a street in this town you take your life into your own hands. My favorite moments where a person almost gets run down happens regulary in Golden Gate Park, where every third or fourth time I use the crosswalk (with a stroller, mind you), I'm nearly run down.
On that note, when the hell is Newsom gonna make his decision on closing the park on Saturdays?
Hmmm, I walk through Golden Gate Park, with stroller as well, and rarely have felt challenged by motorists. I wonder if it is because I see that it is my responsibility to be protective of myself and child in stroller as opposed to believing that everybody must stop for me.
By the way, I was not commenting that pedestrians are losers, but that those who expect the world to stop because you feel like lollygagging across the street can gladly wear the term "loser pedestrian".
I've found that the time of day makes a huge difference for my safety as a pedestrian or cyclist in Golden Gate Park. My daily commute is by bicycle from the Richmond through the park to the Sunset... I make my own hours, so typically I'm commuting midday (10am-2pm) and coming home mid-to-late evening (anywhere from 7:30pm to 5am)... things are always mellow in the park at those times. However, those days I'm actually in sync with the rest of the world and commuting through the park during the morning or evening rush hour it's a different scene altogether. Lots of cars, and lots of rude/oblivious/impatient/on-the-phone drivers. Once in a while, a driver has the gall to honk at me for following the right-of-way at a stop sign or perhaps for simply existing, and all I can think is this is a goddam world-famous park that wasn't built to be a freeway to your soul-numbing financial district job and there's a perfectly good light rail line and express buses you could be taking instead so chill out.
Far too many inconsiderate pedestrians think they can just reach out and hit someone's car. This has happened to me, at an intersection, making a turn while said pedestrian is still on the curb and making no moves to begin crossing until I'm making my turn. Suddenly, a loud bang on the back of my car and some jackass reached out and punched my car. While physically, that was probably a lot more painful for them, but in this instance, your car is an extension of your being and it's the same thing and reaching out and hitting any part of my body.
Pededtrians in SF are waaaay too bold. Not all of them, but a portion of them. So many people wait to cross the street while standing in the middle of the lane. They don't even bother to look both ways across streets without crosswalks. It seems like a troubling epidemic here that San Franciscans have forgotten that cars can kill you and pedestrians should yield to the more powerful automobile. All this said, drivers shouldn't go running people over, either, ever. There is a complete lack of mutual respect here. Each one of us spends a portion of our time walking and a portion of our time driving/riding in a car.
Excellent posting - some common sense.
I agree with you 94118....as a matter of fact I just had an incident not more than 20 minutes ago?
Kid walks next to my car in the street.....trying to cut across before i got to the line where i am supposed to stop....so i moved forward and he sped up and got in front of my car....still not in the crosswalk yet and muttered something as he walked by...since my window was open for the nice day I bellowed to get the fuck in the crossway or shut the fuck up...to which he never turned around and took his scared ass home.
The best is when someone is crossing in the other crosswalk and then cut's out to to cross in front of you....the L shaped fuck over of two car's at a 4 way stop....
or the person who steps off the curb 20 feet behind the people you stopped to yield to and then saunters across.
i do believe that these offenses warrant and ass whupping. not a murder or a hit by car, but an ass whooping.
I am a walker too and I scoot across. It's a two way street pardon the pun.
the best post is the first one.
just shut up and don't engage in hostilities.
and besides the dojo and cop station, aren't there like, a zillion yoga studios etc too? get some zen, dummies.
Randy, the deceased was going off on the driver. His friend ( red plaid flanel shirt ) backed off after the fight started to escalate. The guy tried to run Randy over in the intersection, missed, then drove 15-20 down the sidewalk to mow him down.
I overhead the entire police interview with Randy's friend and he didn't paint a flattering picture of his friend's actions. Certainly it isn't right to kill a guy for being an asshole about the pedestrian right of way...
but it sure points out a very good lesson. Don't f**k with the wrong guy.
He may go to jail for 20 years, but Randy is dead.
This article is a helpful reminder to me to not slam on someone's hood when they almost kill me next time. You never know who you are dealing with and how someone might snap.
My mode of transportation is my long, lovely legs that happen to be gimpy. I am disabled, but if you look at me you would not be able to tell, I spent years in physical therapy learning to walk again. But that doesn't mean I am all better now, I still have bad days. Yes I have walked a little slowly when crossing the street and I will stare down the driver who is obviously agitated that he had to stop. I am only 21, SF94118, if I crossed in your path on one of my bad days, you would probably think I am just some cocky kid, but like the old saying goes, you can't judge a book by its cover.
On the California written driving exam one of the questions is about when do pedestrians have the right away. The correct answer.... ALWAYS. Yes even if it is some crack head, or what especially drives me crazy someone wearing all black or dark colored clothing at night crossing in the middle of a street that is not well lit. Yes some pedestrians are stupid. Don't hold that against all of us.
When crossing the street before on a crosswalk not protected by stop signs or lights I have literally had to play Vanna White with the crosswalk sign! If you see a tall chick with long hair doing this for the love of God please stop and let me cross the street, and don't get pissed if I move a bit slowly.
If you do stop you will likely get a nice sweet southern smile from lil' ole' me. ;)
Like I said before, I knew somebody would misinterpet my comments and act like the victim. Its funny as I slow down and yield at most every intersection to allow pedestrians to cross, nevertheless, my comments were directed at those who intentionally lollygag across the street in an effort at thumbing their nose at motorists. And of course, you have no right to slam the hood of a motorist as this would be an act of aggression and might get you in trouble. Now quite acting like a whiny victim.
SF94118: "Now quite(sic) acting like a whiny victim." That's funny coming from someone who feels victimized by a pedestrian taking a few extra seconds to cross the street.
It is way beyond time to start reigning in the literally murderous automobile drivers in this city.
I think we should:
1) Charge people for driving here. Take a cue from Mayor Livingstone in London and charge people an extra $5 a day for entering the central business district. Driving a car in a crowded urban core is an anti-social act.
2) Make it harder to get a driver's license. Way too many people who are clearly mentally and psychologically unfit to drive, like our friend SF94118, are ticking time bombs. These people should have their driver's license revoked.
3) Crack down on scofflaws who drive without a license. This needs to go with #2, or revoking their driving privilege will have no effect.
Response to NoeValleyJim:
1. Not sure about the validity of the proposal but could be worth studying. I suppose then we should also prevent bicyclists in the CBD as they would become hazardous to pedestrians as well.
2. Yes, it should be harder to get a driver's license. Who would you wish to include in the group that could not easily get a license? As I said, I go out of my way to stop at intersections to allow for pedestrians, almost to the point of getting nailed by other motorists behind me.
3. Could not agree more.
Finally, my entire point has been missed. I was merely commenting on pedestrians who seek to overtly challenge motorist or wish to hit their car for simply trying to make a right hand turn or something similar.
Okay, you didn't rise to the bait, so I have to revise my opinion of you. Maybe you are not a seething ball of road-rage, waiting to explode afterall. :-)
Plenty of cities have car-free zones, where only delivery trucks are allowed and only after hours. Not sure how we would want to deal with bicyclists. They could probably have some sort of restricted access.
The skills test for getting an automobile license should be made more difficult. It would be very easy to do this: currently most people fail the motorcycle exam the first try and that is just because the DMV has decided to make the exam difficult. I am not sure how we could screen for "likely to lose their temper" though. Perhaps a pyschological exam?
Yes, people who deliberately walk out in front of cars are kind of stupid and annoying. Not sure why you focus on people in crosswalks in front of right turners though. That seems like a case where the pedestrian clearly has the right of way.
I have heard of the idea of charging for driving in the CBD, but I would just as well not allow it as opposed to levying another charge on people. This city already has its hands in the pockets of citizens and taxpayers way too much for another shakedown.
Yup, pedestrians do have the right of way at crosswalks, and I also have the ability to turn right after stopping at a red light (without plowing over a pedestrian). Not picking on them, just using an example. In fact, I generally make eye contact with a pedestrian and frequently gesture one way or another to acknowledge their presence so that nobody is endangered.
By the way, regarding my not taking the bait, I suppose you are talking about this comment "Way too many people who are clearly mentally and psychologically unfit to drive, like our friend SF94118, are ticking time bombs."
Why bother responding to this comment as it only displays your ignorance for making judgements about me when you really have no basis.
Really? You keep threatening to run people over, on this and other threads. Why do you keep making this threat, unless you have the intention of either carrying it out, trying to goad others into a response, or provoke others into political action?
I strongly encourage you to seek out professional help, before you act on your threats and end up in jail or worse because of your criminal desires.
If you are encouraging others to participate in the political process, be glad, because I attended a SPUR meeting today and intend to further my participation in the Muni Transit Effectiveness Project. You have helped create another "Car Free City" advocate. I doubt that was your intent.
Interesting. You label me and call me names and I respond to your comments. I point out the stupidity of your labeling me and now you resort to more name calling and telling me I need help. Hmmm??? Seems like you have difficulty looking at yourself. By the way, I have never and would never threaten to run somebody over - not my thing.
In fact, I have never and would never advocate for hurting a pedestrian. My original comments were that I was surprised that this unfortunate incident had not happened sooner based upon the animosity between some pedestrians towards motorists (as clearly displayed by your comments). Unlike you, I am trying to find accomodations so that we can all live and operate here peacefully whereas you seem to wish to take away peoples rights to operate vehicles.
Hmm, okay, you just advocate running over bicyclists.
"I agree that we should take these matters into our own hands. Do you also think I should take the liberty of just running over a few stupid f--king bicyclsts on Market Street who don't obey the same traffic laws that most of us obey? I would not mind."
I guess that makes you "okay," right?
I think I've made very clear over and over again that I am not in favor or hurting anybody, be it pedestrian or cyclists. The comments above reflect frustration and nothing more. You are amusing, first you label me and then when I respond, you say that maybe I am not so bad after all. Then when I take you to task for judging me erroneously, you go back on the attack with labels, etc. You have no consistency with your arguments. Back to cars - you see, I seek positive co-existence between pedestrians, cyclists and motorists, whereas you seek to eliminate one form of transportation in favor of others. You are the one who is absolutely intolerant of others who don't share your visions.
It's clearly difficult for some to accept, but pedestrians have the right of way. Remember 10th grade driver's ed?
I couldn't agree more
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzjV3Zzvhf4
94118 stated that pedestrians could scoot across a little faster instead of giving him the proverbial finger "because they can"
More are gonna get laid out.....and it won't be by 94118.
He's the guy you don't have to worry about but your'e too fucking stupid to realize it.