SFist: Why Does 511 Suck So Much?

Ocean

Sat, 17 Mar 2007 19:35:16 -0800

This is quite interesting... 511 needs help from 911! On Friday March 16, upon hearing a number of confliciting reports via radio regarding the "road buckling" in an area where I was to travel I thought I'd be resourceful and thus get to "the bottom" of what was really going on... so I called 511 for help. I stated the city Vallejo-- however,511 said "did you say Glen Ellen?" I responded with "no Va-ll-ejo the response I got back again was "did you say Glen Ellen?" To say the least I was mired with absolute frustration being that the early Friday commute had begun and I wanted to get on the road from work early too. I finally got a response by sounding out "Va-ll-ejo" for the second time putting GREAT focus on on the two l's in the name and found that there was one incident. A recorded voice came on... it was a man with a very thick accent. I couldn't understand a word he said except for take 680. I was thinking... "is this a joke? Where's the camera?" I just wanted to go home that's all. I just wanted to be resourceful and utilize a tool that my tax dollars have paid for. To say the least, I was NOT impressed.

Austin

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 17:38:43 -0800

Have you ever taken one of the many regional bus services, provided by Muni, Golden Gate, AC, Samtrans, or VTA, that use (shudder!) freeways or even the Bay Bridge? These are directly affected by traffic. Huh? Who would check traffic cameras to see when their bus is coming? Knowing the location of a slowdown that may affect a bus line isn't particularly helpful. Something like the driving times for how long transbay buses are taking would be far more useful (let alone that most busses in the Bay Area don't run on freeways, and more people take BART than the transbay busses).

MattyMatt

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 14:33:37 -0800

Fair enough. But a most of that info is hosted on other agencies' websites -- so it's a scavenger hunt. And sometimes 511's links are out-of-date and broken altogether. Sometimes the info is right there on 511.org;, which makes life easy. But other times, 511 points you all over the internet, so users have to search. Or, more likely, give up. Providing info for bikes is strictly optional for 511s -- that's what I mean when I say that it's designed to be incompatible with a major city like SF.

Steve Boland

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 14:27:27 -0800

Right on, matty. You've done a public service here. It's not that 511 cares about drivers; it's that it doesn't care about anyone else. This is not too much to ask of an agency--MTC, 511's sponsor--that has been vested with responsibility for the entire regional transportation network, not to mention billions and billions of your dollars and mine. If you find 511 satisfactory, it might just be a case of not knowing what you're missing.

Elizabeth

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 14:25:29 -0800

Let's compare- bicycling.511.org has: 511 BikeMapper Bay Area Bicycle Maps » Bikes on Transit Bicycle Parking » Bikes on Bridges Bike Buddy Matching Bicycle Safety » Commuting by Bike Selecting a Bike Bicycle Organizations Bike to Work Day » Bike Classes

MattyMatt

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 14:00:17 -0800

I don't own a bike, so I don't know exactly what bicyclists need to make their lives easier. But here's a partial list of the information provided by the SF Bike Coalition -- just imagine how much more detailed and accurate this info could be if combined with the institutional knowledge of the MTC: Urban Bike Training; Safety and Security; Biking with Kids; Maps and Reference; Bike Law 101; Racks, Panniers, and Trailers; Bikes on Transit.

Ciaran

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 13:09:26 -0800

Face it Matt, while you and I are tooling around the city on our bikes or by Muni, the other 5 million people in the bay area are driving their SUVs on the freeways. As an information source, 511 reflects that. I don't think it was ever intended to be an advocacy site. And I don't understand what you expect 511 to provide for cyclists - road conditions? They're crap everywhere, and they don't change. Maps? Sure, but a map of SF isn't hard to come by online. As for Muni getting it's information act together, that's another matter entirely.

MattyMatt

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 12:38:52 -0800

How often do commuters -- even car commuters -- log on to 511 to check traffic cameras before leaving the house? Not very often, I bet. But it's one of the major, mandatory features. That's not so much a criticism of 511's incompatibility with SF, and more a criticism of the generally user-unfriendly presentation of data.

Boo hoo

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 12:36:02 -0800

Look. 511 is crap. This is true and well known. But these SF centric comments are crap too. The fact is that people all around the Bay Area travel all around the Bay Area. Expecting 511 to cater to every whim of SF users instead of showing region-wide options is just not realistic. This is why there is relatively more info about SF bike info (for example) on sfmta.com than on 511. Here's a great example of myopic SF centrism: We do not. Care. About. The damn traffic cameras. Have you ever taken one of the many regional bus services, provided by Muni, Golden Gate, AC, Samtrans, or VTA, that use (shudder!) freeways or even the Bay Bridge? These are directly affected by traffic. Of course Nextbus style predictions are more user friendly for bus riders, but these are useful as well. But then again, whato do you expect from a website named after a phone number?

MattyMatt

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 11:57:30 -0800

Nobody's talking about crippling tools; it would be great if 511 worked for everyone -- even commuters forced to use cars. But what we've got now is a system that, by design, avoids providing services for a major city's preferred methods of transit. I mean, putting bike maps online, or bus predictions on the phone system -- would that REALLY be so hard for 511? Would it cripple the car-tools? I don't think they should make car ownership harder. But if we're going to relieve road congestion, pollution, and urban blight, we have to make the alternatives easier

Elizabeth

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 11:51:18 -0800

So they should cripple the tools for cars until they are on par with the offerings for bikes? 511 serves the entire Bay Area, not just San Francisco. Bully for SF- we have published a Bicycle Plan (not necessarily the same thing as our transportation goals- just the dreams of one advisory committee). But this plan is specific to SF, and that takes a special kind of arrogance to suggest that what SF's Bicycle Advisory Committee wants for San Francisco is what's best for the entire Bay Area.

Mark 2000

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 11:49:29 -0800

I have to agree with Liz. While trip planner could really use an update it does generally get me where I need to be.

MattyMatt

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 11:33:05 -0800

Michael -- good luck finding info on Church Street surface conditions. You can spend hours on the phone with 511, but you'll never find a way to get any info -- any at all -- on the surface conditions of city transit corridors. On the other hand, the moment there's a slowdown on any bay area freeway, that info pops right up.

MattyMatt

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 11:20:49 -0800

Encouraging car trips over bikes and buses is a perfect reason to condemn a whole thing. Five-eleven is designed to be incompatible with SF transportation goals.

Elizabeth

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 11:17:28 -0800

Sweet jesus don't condemn the whole thing just because it sucks for bikes. I use the TakeTransit Trip Planner all the time and I've never had a problem. Driving Times are eerily accurate both on the website and when you call 511.

Dan

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 11:12:31 -0800

That's an easy one. All you need to do is put a static file in for the following streets: Church Street Valencia Street Market Street Mission Street With the words. "The conditions on this street are similar to what you'll find in Kathmandu, except there they actually pave over the problems, whereas we leave them to annihilate your bike tires and smash your car shocks until someone does a TV news story about it. Then we put a metal plate in the hole." By doing this, and making this file static, they'd increase the accuracy of total amount of information on 511.org by at least 30%.

Accidental Haircut

Fri, 16 Mar 2007 11:06:36 -0800

But Matt, what ~are~ the road surface conditions on Church Street? I MUST KNOW!!!